Grand Standing or making a point? you decide

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/az-sheriff-why-more-troops-korean-border

"AZ Sheriff: Why More Troops at Korean Border Than U.S. Border?
Monday, June 20, 2011
By Penny Starr

(CNSNews.com) – Arizona Sheriff Paul Babeu said the Obama administration’s decision to extend the deployment of 1,200 U.S. National Guard troops along the U.S. border with Mexico until Sept. 30 is “pandering” and that those numbers “fall far short” of what military power is needed to keep the country safe.

Babeu noted, for comparison, the 28,500 U.S. troops stationed in South Korea to help defend it against North Korean aggression; U.S. troops have been stationed in South Korea for 58 years.

Babeu is the sheriff of Pinal County in southern Arizona and is on the frontlines against illegal immigration, human traffickers, drug smugglers, and potential terrorists. He was named the 2011 National Sheriff of the Year by the National Sheriff’s Association on Sunday, June 19.

“What are we doing?” Babeu told CNSNews.com by telephone. “We need 6,000 armed soldiers on our border to protect America. Homeland Security starts at home.”

Babeu said that only 520 guardsmen are deployed in Arizona, a state with a 276-mile border with Mexico and the state that has, according to the Department of Homeland Security, the greatest influx of illegal aliens. In 2010, approximately 212,000 illegal aliens were seized in the Tucson sector of Arizona – or 47 percent of all illegal aliens taken into custody.

“The gravest national security risk that we face is right here with the unsecure border with Mexico,” Babeu said. “Right from the beginning, these 1,200 [National Guard] soldiers fall far short from what’s really, truly needed to achieve a secure border.” . . " more at the link

which is it, grand standing or making a point? discuss

and theres this video too

http://www.cnsnews.com/cnsnewstv/v/84052


Post edited by Killet at 6/21/2011 9:33:46 AM

Yes, he's making a point by grand standing on a idiotic comparison. I agree with him that we need to militarize the border if we want some more security. But, let's be real here - the HIV from Tijuana and cartels in Juarez don't necessarily equate to crazed lunatics laughing maniacally as they make nuclear weapons.

But, hey, more power to him for arming up our southern border. Shit, if that's how he thinks we should do that, then lets tack on another tour for those coming back from abroad.
Post edited by CaptPlanet at 6/21/2011 4:21:31 PM

I would prefer we beef up the border patrol division, make it more para-military similar to SWAT, put alot more of them on the border and give them some air superiority, and some authority to actually do something. Fast attack vehicles, helicopters and lots of them. I would prefer we spend the money on that and just leave a hundred guys on the SK border, seriously if NK invades its not like 28000 troops are going to stop them

We're broke...we can only afford these nifty Chinese made walki-talkies from Wal-Mart and a pack of gum.

then lets get a bunch of them

The soldiers in Asia provide a defense shield for opponents of China: Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Besides, the unemployment rate is high; just recruit people to guard the border--once they get through training, of course.

Originally posted by: CaptPlanet
We're broke...we can only afford these nifty Chinese made walki-talkies from Wal-Mart and a pack of gum.

Maybe if we plugged that hole, we wouldn't be so broke.

Originally posted by: -EB- Bluedoctor
The soldiers in Asia provide a defense shield for opponents of China: Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Besides, the unemployment rate is high; just recruit people to guard the border--once they get through training, of course.

Fuck Asia. They can protect themselves.

Secondly, the last thing we need is more government employees leeching off of the rest of us. We have the military for this very purpose. We need to use them.

_________________
See through the propaganda. Stop empowering and enriching the state by cheering its wars. Set aside the television talking points. Look at the world anew, without the prejudices of the past, and without favoring your own government’s version of things. Be decent. Be human. Do not be deceived by the Joe Bidens, the John McCains, the Barack Obamas and Hillary Clintons. Reject the biggest government program of them all. Peace builds. War destroys.
-Lew Rockwell

Originally posted by: Nathan Bedford Forrest

Originally posted by: -EB- Bluedoctor
The soldiers in Asia provide a defense shield for opponents of China: Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Besides, the unemployment rate is high; just recruit people to guard the border--once they get through training, of course.

Fuck Asia. They can protect themselves.

Secondly, the last thing we need is more government employees leeching off of the rest of us. We have the military for this very purpose. We need to use them.

agreed but I think the border patrol should become a branch of our military, border security is at least important enough to rate that . . . amirite?

Originally posted by: Killet

Originally posted by: Nathan Bedford Forrest

Originally posted by: -EB- Bluedoctor
The soldiers in Asia provide a defense shield for opponents of China: Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Besides, the unemployment rate is high; just recruit people to guard the border--once they get through training, of course.

Fuck Asia. They can protect themselves.

Secondly, the last thing we need is more government employees leeching off of the rest of us. We have the military for this very purpose. We need to use them.

agreed but I think the border patrol should become a branch of our military, border security is at least important enough to rate that . . . amirite?

This sounds like a great job for the national guard. There's no need for another beuracracy which is all that another branch would amount to.

If the DHS were meant to be anything other than the Gestapo, they would be handling this already. But, I'm digressing into one of the most zealous power grabs in American history there... Thanks a lot, Bush, you piece of shit.


_________________
See through the propaganda. Stop empowering and enriching the state by cheering its wars. Set aside the television talking points. Look at the world anew, without the prejudices of the past, and without favoring your own government’s version of things. Be decent. Be human. Do not be deceived by the Joe Bidens, the John McCains, the Barack Obamas and Hillary Clintons. Reject the biggest government program of them all. Peace builds. War destroys.
-Lew Rockwell

arent the NG state directed? I wouldnt want the burden put on the border states only, seems like it should be a federal issue

Originally posted by: Killet
arent the NG state directed? I wouldnt want the burden put on the border states only, seems like it should be a federal issue

The states are having to handle the issue anyhow since the Feds won't, but that's a fair point. Use the regular army then.

_________________
See through the propaganda. Stop empowering and enriching the state by cheering its wars. Set aside the television talking points. Look at the world anew, without the prejudices of the past, and without favoring your own government’s version of things. Be decent. Be human. Do not be deceived by the Joe Bidens, the John McCains, the Barack Obamas and Hillary Clintons. Reject the biggest government program of them all. Peace builds. War destroys.
-Lew Rockwell

Originally posted by: Nathan Bedford Forrest

Originally posted by: -EB- Bluedoctor
The soldiers in Asia provide a defense shield for opponents of China: Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Besides, the unemployment rate is high; just recruit people to guard the border--once they get through training, of course.

Fuck Asia. They can protect themselves.

Secondly, the last thing we need is more government employees leeching off of the rest of us. We have the military for this very purpose. We need to use them.

psst, military=government employee

Originally posted by: CaptPlanet

Originally posted by: Nathan Bedford Forrest

Originally posted by: -EB- Bluedoctor
The soldiers in Asia provide a defense shield for opponents of China: Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Besides, the unemployment rate is high; just recruit people to guard the border--once they get through training, of course.

Fuck Asia. They can protect themselves.

Secondly, the last thing we need is more government employees leeching off of the rest of us. We have the military for this very purpose. We need to use them.

psst, military=government employee

Psst, no shit, dumbass.

The emphasis is on the word "more"

Post edited by Nathan Bedford Forrest at 6/23/2011 9:12:20 PM

_________________
See through the propaganda. Stop empowering and enriching the state by cheering its wars. Set aside the television talking points. Look at the world anew, without the prejudices of the past, and without favoring your own government’s version of things. Be decent. Be human. Do not be deceived by the Joe Bidens, the John McCains, the Barack Obamas and Hillary Clintons. Reject the biggest government program of them all. Peace builds. War destroys.
-Lew Rockwell

Originally posted by: CaptPlanet
Yes, he's making a point by grand standing on a idiotic comparison. I agree with him that we need to militarize the border if we want some more security. But, let's be real here - the HIV from Tijuana and cartels in Juarez don't necessarily equate to crazed lunatics laughing maniacally as they make nuclear weapons.

But, hey, more power to him for arming up our southern border. Shit, if that's how he thinks we should do that, then lets tack on another tour for those coming back from abroad.

I call it basic priorities....

I say that the threat I can see, confront, measure and have to deal with almost every single day (especially here in California) have a much higher importance level for America than the sixty year old McCarthyism fears that you are talking about.

I'd argue that this is analogous to preparing your home for an attack against Islmaic Jihadists while your neighbors keep breaking into your house, stealing your shit, raping your dog, and taking a massive shit on your carpet.

Originally posted by: Nathan Bedford Forrest

Originally posted by: -EB- Bluedoctor
The soldiers in Asia provide a defense shield for opponents of China: Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Besides, the unemployment rate is high; just recruit people to guard the border--once they get through training, of course.

Fuck Asia. They can protect themselves.

Secondly, the last thing we need is more government employees leeching off of the rest of us. We have the military for this very purpose. We need to use them.

Exactly...call it crazy.......but I remember back when the National Guard actually, you know, guarded our Nation.

What a crazy concept indeed.

Originally posted by: Killet
arent the NG state directed? I wouldnt want the burden put on the border states only, seems like it should be a federal issue

Not entirely.

They are mostly federally funded and almost always act under the control of the federal government in the modern era.

The state government can call on its own national guard though, in times of emergency or civil unrest.

Federal troops can't be used inside US borders for law enforcement purposes (without exploiting loopholes) which is what I think this stuff legally falls under.

Bottom line, the federal government could probably call on the national guard from any state and send them to the border for months at a time. That would put the national guard to use and spread the burden of providing manpower around all 50 states.

However, national guardsmen acting on federal orders may also have that 'no law enforcement inside the US by federal troops' thing applied. Not really sure there.

Originally posted by: Allen

They are mostly federally funded and almost always act under the control of the federal government in the modern era.

State funded unless called upon by the government

Originally posted by: Allen
The state government can call on its own national guard though, in times of emergency or civil unrest.

True at the states expense.

Originally posted by: Allen
Federal troops can't be used inside US borders for law enforcement purposes (without exploiting loopholes) which is what I think this stuff legally falls under.

False. And the have no arrest powers.

Originally posted by: Allen
Bottom line, the federal government could probably call on the national guard from any state and send them to the border for months at a time. That would put the national guard to use and spread the burden of providing manpower around all 50 states.

True and the government would fund it and the NG troops would have jobs in the process with protecting the borders. I think its a good idea.

Originally posted by: Allen
However, national guardsmen acting on federal orders may also have that 'no law enforcement inside the US by federal troops' thing applied. Not really sure there.

Very true. They would need real law enforcement augmenting them to handle the finer aspects of policing. (possy comototus) Comes to mind, please excuse the spelling have not a clue

Originally posted by: Dieslut

Originally posted by: Allen

They are mostly federally funded and almost always act under the control of the federal government in the modern era.

State funded unless called upon by the government

Mostly federally funded, but states usually augment the funding and provide state specific benefits.

Examples:

http://www.ng.mil/news/archives/2010/01/012010-National.aspx

http://www.ng.mil/ll/analysisdocs/FY2012/NGB-LL%20Analysis%20of%20FY12%20Defense%20Appropriations.pdf

http://www.news-journalonline.com/news/local/flagler/2011/06/15/funding-shift-could-be-boon-to-building-flagler-national-guard-center.html

They also go to basic training and specialty schools along side active duty soldiers (officers and enlisted).

I agree with the rest of what you said though. There are times when federal troops are used domestically but without arrest powers. It's sketchy though.

If we just had a competent military leader, someone along the lines of General William Tecumseh Sherman; we could send a quick clear message to mexico that we won't tolerate their criminal exportation any longer.
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Originally posted by: =NCG=Leonidas
If we just had a competent military leader, someone along the lines of General William Tecumseh Sherman; we could send a quick clear message to mexico that we won't tolerate their criminal exportation any longer.

We'll take care of Mexico after we finish wiping out Iran. Get your priorities straight.

Every military base, military academy, fbi office, fbi training facility, and police academy in the lower 48 should be relocated to the border of mexico.
Post edited by Buzzed at 12/25/2011 12:57:56 PM

Originally posted by: Buzzed
Every military base and military academy in the lower 48 should be relocated to the border of mexico.

Originally posted by: fixed
Every fbi office, fbi training facility, and police academy in the lower 48 should be relocated next door to illegal immigrant employers.

The illegal immigrant problem is a black market labor problem. As long as there is a demand for black market labor, it will be hard to interdict it and it makes any guest worker or visa system a joke.
Post edited by Stryk at 2/19/2012 7:15:41 PM