Code Security and MAM

The rules clearly state that no mods may be on the server other than CS and starting 6/1 the realism mod on realism servers. What is agreed upon betweeen teams before a match is an exception - not a rule.

Saying "we always had MAM on our server and always will" is a clear challenge to the rules and an indication that he intends to run the program with or without the consent of his opponents or the sanction of TWL.

-edit added text-

By the way - arent you part of the observer corps, now? You should be required to know the rules before you are made an observer, imo. Nothing personal - just an observation.

Post edited by Cpl kearns at 5/29/2003 6:25:54 PM

Don't attack grin reaper, it is the status quo that people use MAM hence not breaking the rules (I will prove this point in my next post)

Cpl kearns, I see you are one of those teams that will do anything for a win, that is fine by me, but I am here to compete in a cheat free environment (well at least as much as possible)

Also like u quoted me, we always had MAM and always will, but what you failed to read is that we have CS too, but EVERYTHING it does MAM does, our server got changed too a new box and some of the files did not copy over correctly (CS, and so it wasn't functional), but MAM was running, but the team we were playing on tdm 2v2 wanted us to forfeit even though we re-uploaded it (but our server guy wasn’t here to reconfig it), so that team got a admin and guess what the admin said we can play b/c MAM was there and functional, but the other team decided to kill the match instead (that still boggles my mind that they challenge us and just wanted to kill the match even though a admin oked it). See the rules state one thing, but everyone (including admins) do another.


The ONLY reason I want this rule changed is b/c of clans/people like you. It’s just another inconvenience running into you on the ladder. The reason I posted here about this was b/c of that clan that tried to get the forfeit win.

MAM IS better than CS, people use MAM anyways, and the sooner you realize that and change the rules just a little (allow the option of using MAM) the sooner this ladder gets better. (Also if you do this the disputes will also decreases, probably 50% of the disputes are from clans like Cpl kearns. This will give OC’s and Admins more time to deal with real issues.

So like I said in my previous post, it is the status quo that clans use MAM and that it works, that is why we got the ruling in our favor by an admin.

These ladders are here so that we can play and prove who is the best, not cause disputes and petty bickering like you say you do.
Post edited by ·|ÐöðM|·olord at 5/31/2003 1:47:58 PM

better. what is better? It all depends on opinion. Once again, the opinion expressed in both the rules and the forums by the admins is that CS is to be used and that MAM is too powerful. Again, there is no way in hell I would personally trust another team when they have the power to kick or make our player(s) lag through MAM. Mo power(aka money) = mo problems.

It is any teams personal decision to force a forfeit if the other team isn't obeying the rules. You may think they're bad for it or whatever, but they can do it. Obey the rules to the letter and there won't be a problem.

This is going to be fun....

Originally posted by: ·|ÐöðM|·olord

Cpl kearns, I see you are one of those teams that will do anything for a win, that is fine by me, but I am here to compete in a cheat free environment (well at least as much as possible)

Nice leap in logic. How do you see that I am one of those teams? Because I follow the rules? I bet you're the type of guy that thinks that strikes shouldn't count in baseball.

Also like u quoted me, we always had MAM and always will, but what you failed to read is that we have CS too, but EVERYTHING it does MAM does, our server got changed too a new box and some of the files did not copy over correctly (CS, and so it wasn't functional), but MAM was running, but the team we were playing on tdm 2v2 wanted us to forfeit even though we re-uploaded it (but our server guy wasn’t here to reconfig it), so that team got a admin and guess what the admin said we can play b/c MAM was there and functional, but the other team decided to kill the match instead (that still boggles my mind that they challenge us and just wanted to kill the match even though a admin oked it). See the rules state one thing, but everyone (including admins) do another.

Lots of little things:

1. Im glad you have CS, because it is required by the rules.
2. I know what MAM does.
3. Your server problems are not my problem, or your opponents - the rules state that every team is required to have their server properly set up for match play. Failure to have your server set up for match play should forfiet the use of your server.
4. If your opponents did not agree to using MAM, then the TWL Admin was wrong. The rules are clear. There is nothing ambiguous - there is no gray area.

The ONLY reason I want this rule changed is b/c of clans/people like you. It’s just another inconvenience running into you on the ladder. The reason I posted here about this was b/c of that clan that tried to get the forfeit win.

SO...you want this rule changed because you agree with me that people will attempt to circumvent the rules by any and every means possible? You agree that people will use seemingly useful and beneficial tools to cheat and cover up cheating? And you agree that that team DESERVED a forfiet or a rematch or a match kill because you were attempting run a modification during a match without their consent?

MAM IS better than CS, people use MAM anyways, and the sooner you realize that and change the rules just a little (allow the option of using MAM) the sooner this ladder gets better. (Also if you do this the disputes will also decreases, probably 50% of the disputes are from clans like Cpl kearns. This will give OC’s and Admins more time to deal with real issues.

MAM is better than CS - we all know that. Why is it better? Because it can do a whole lot of shit that CS cant do. Why didnt the TWL admins say we're going to use MAM? Because it can do a whole lot of shit that CS cant do. Real simple.

Oh, and we've disputed one match in 11 months playing in 4 ladders. I want to personally apologize to the TWL admins for keeping them so busy.

So like I said in my previous post, it is the status quo that clans use MAM and that it works, that is why we got the ruling in our favor by an admin.

These ladders are here so that we can play and prove who is the best, not cause disputes and petty bickering like you say you do.

Status quo means nothing. "Ive always robbed little old ladies, so why are you arresting me now?" I guess I should repeat the advice I gave Grin to you and the TWL admin in question - you really need to learn the rules.

As far as disputes and petty bickering - you're barking up the wrong tree there.

I was right, it WAS fun olord.

Later

yes, i'm part of the obs. corp now, and yes it would be very nice if i memorized the whole page of rules. i know them well enough, i have a computer with a web browser to check in case i don't know, or one thing or another is in question. also, the OC's job is more or less to be in the background just OBSERVING. we provide an unbiased account on what happened. you confuse Admins with OCs maybe. and yes, i do know the rules fairly well, but i'm not going to say "it clearly states exactly this." there are some gray areas in the rules, and updates aren't always timely. i don't have the power vested in me to lay down the law. and especially as an OC, i wouldn't want to accidently give false information if i have interpreted the rules wrong.

as for the always have and always will used MAM, i'm assuming olord meant in "general" play. in fact, i think i'm going to start asking in match comms if they don't mind if we use MAM for the match. as for being too powerful, that's no longer an issue as i've pointed out it's very easy to disable those commands deemed too powerful, and they can't just be turned on with an rcon command (gotta change the config and all). right now the admins are currently testing new anti-cheat meassures, and rest assured, things to the like of MAM are being considered. if you care so much about these discussions, start talking to an admin, find them in the IRC channel, or email them.

FOR THE LAST TIME, i'm NOT GRIM!