ATTN: tourney rule-set suggestion

Assuming the upcoming Swat 4 tourney is going to be a 4v4 VIP format, I would like to request a rule clarification and bring this issue out to public attention.

Further assuming the MP/beta demo ladder rule-set will be somewhat used in shaping the tourney rule-set, the issue of the round timer expiring seems to be an area of controversy. It seems that there has previously been some ambiguity on scoring when the timer reaches zero; whether it counts as a tie, win/loss, or whether it counts towards the team score in any way at all.

From my personal (and limited) experience, it seems that the only logical option in this particular scenario would be to *honor a win to the suspects*. Let me explain why:

1. It is the SWAT's objective and responsibility to escort the VIP to the escape zone. If they fail to do so in the alotted time [in the demo ladder's case, 10min], the suspects have successfully fended them off and should be rewarded. If they are not rewarded, what purpose does having a round timer serve at all?

2. Although this is dependant on the particular map, it should be applicable to the majority of the map cycle. Not penalizing SWAT does not give them a sense of urgency to carry out their objective. (i.e. it enables them the option of indefinitely camping their spawn)

3. This is partially a collory to #2, but if a win is not given to the suspects, complications may arise with time limitations. Of course, all competitors are expected to set aside a reasonable amount of time into matches, but reality dictates that we have other activities that need tending. Without such rule implementations, such a loophole is subject to abuse. (i.e. intentionally taking advantage of a team that doesn't have as much time as yourself)

These are just some observations of mine, but I urge the admins to consider them.

If, for whatever reason, you decide not to give the suspects a win at timer break, I strongly request a clear explanation on how this particular situation will be handled (before the tournament actually starts).

You can contact me at AIM 'lokigoesrawr' or lokigoesrawr @ gmail.com, if needed.

Thanks.

A bit I left out on #2:

The timer break should especially not count as a tie. Some maps (mp-courthouse comes to mind) are generally considered to be suspect-oriented. If that is the case, it may give some incentive for SWAT to actually camp their spawn and wait out the timer to settle for a tie rather than risk a VIP capture.

[I would like to point out that all scenarios/examples I have depicted are entirely hypothetical and any resemblance to any cases are purely coincidental.]

the tourney will not be VIP..it will be barricaded suspects :-)..i think no respawns too

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FwF|Agent|TWL
TeamWarfare SWAT 4 Competition Staff
Email: agent@teamwarfare.com
IRC: #teamwarfare, #twl_swat

NO RESPAWNS?!?!? NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

yeah, exactly
NO RESPAWNSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS? NO! thats what makes this game so golden. respawns for the win!

Let's not get up in arms yet. Still working on the rules. It is a TDM event and quite frankly I like the no re-spawns. It makes it much more realistic.

With re-spawns you don't have to be so careful. No Re-spawns means you need to be mistake free.

No respawns means everyone will be waiting in corners...

I've already done inner clan 4v4s on TDM, and whoever defends always wins.

This isn't the way imo that the game should be played. Especially on maps like the chinese food wall, the teams spawn right next to each other.

However, it is one of the best maps and by far the most popular I have played. It's also pretty well suited for 4v4.

So basically if there is no respawns, I think it will be whichever team is most patient, with hundreds of ties. I personally think VIP is best suited since it is most team oriented, but if you're gunna do TDM, please don't do no respawns.

Excuse my ignorance but why are we limiting ourselves to one style of play. I can understand begining with a simple ladder of TDM wich involves no respawns. After all it is easy to determine who wins or loses. There is always room for more styles of play as time goes on like in many other games. Im ok with no respawns for now but would hope later on there will many variations on victory conditions for all the game types. This game has sooo many options and what a curse to have eh? But for this one tourney, camp or no camp, simple is best.
Post edited by Bunks at 4/11/2005 11:49:23 AM

we are speaking of this specific tourney. I'm sure there will be several ladders with different rules. Maybe even leagues with seasons afterwards. I simply would like to have respawns. In theory, no respawning would make it better, people would treasure their life more, they wouldn't do stupid things, but ingame it all turns into who is the biggest pansy and who waits the longest. I really am looking foward to this tourney and sincerely hope it doesn't turn into that.

On Second Thought:
A good gamestyle would be defuse the bomb. Very team oriented, but one team is not unballanced since they have the VIP. The amount of time the SWAT side has to defuse the bombs can be changed, and after a few tests between equal teams, a reasonably fair time to both sides could be settled on I'm sure.

Originally posted by: TaskMaster

A good gamestyle would be defuse the bomb. Very team oriented. The amount of time the SWAT side has to defuse the bombs can be changed, and after a few tests between equal teams, a reasonably fair time to both sides could be settled on I'm sure.

Im 101% percent agree with this fool, defuse the bomb is probably the most team oriented type that requires perfect timing and mistake free gaming. TDM with no respawns is going to cause lots of problems and complains from the community. Cant wait till the tourny
Rules for signatures Hanni

No stranger to complaints here. Just ask my wife.

do you have xfire? I'd like to discuss this with you.

Good point TASK...and for all the admins contact info refer here:

http://www.teamwarfare.com/forums/showthread.asp?forumid=281&threadid=197097

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FwF|Agent|TWL
TeamWarfare SWAT 4 Competition Staff
Email: agent@teamwarfare.com
IRC: #teamwarfare, #twl_swat

no respawns, Hurray!!

:-) thought u might like that

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FwF|Agent|TWL
TeamWarfare SWAT 4 Competition Staff
Email: agent@teamwarfare.com
IRC: #teamwarfare, #twl_swat

I know the admins do have duties etc, and if you turn this down I can understand. But I'd like to have a community vote on the gametype. If not, at least have a few scrims with the proposed rules to make sure it does not turn out as I fear.

I've been playing since beta was first released, obviously that makes me VIP biased.

I do enjoy playing the TDM type with Barricaded Suspects, but for maps like the restaraunt and fairfax residence I just don't see how a no respawn rule would work.

Whichever team starts inside the building (if their worth winning a prize) will NEVER lose. There will be so many ties it will just be who can find the worst possible team to play.

I like the defuse the bomb idea as well, although its not my favorite type of gameplay it works out the best in my opinion. The only problem is the number of bombs that spawns. If that could be controlled then I forsee few problems with that scenario, as it is one team might get 3 bombs to disable and when they defend the other team has 5.

This could cause some teams to complain, even though they have more time to defuse.

If you do TDM style, respawns would be a good idea with a score limit to reach, not time limit. That way it makes arrests more valuable. If there are no respawns then arrests are kind of pointless, and arrests usually take more skill.

If there is a score limit it will make teams work together using a combo of non-lethals for the arrests, and lethals to get the other guys off your back while you make the arrest.