Removed from 5's Ladder

Any reason why so many teams seem to have been removed from the ladder? We were last ranked around 15 or so with an upcoming match scheduled and now my team and the opposing team were removed entirely from the ladder. Tried contacting an admin in #twl_cs but not getting any response. Also, last I remember there were around 130+ teams, which is suddenly down to 71...

So what's the deal? Happen to anybody else?

A lot of people have been complaining about teams being inactive. The TWL staff told us that they would issue a 'clean out' of the ladders to avoid having teams wait for their challenge being accepted.

If you are inactive for 2 weeks or more, or have received 3 forfeit losses in the last 45 days you would be removed.
Post edited by Rubber Bullets at 6/7/2009 8:39:50 PM

We were very active, DID have one week that we could not make it but was not counted as a forfeit loss, and had already scheduled a match against a team that was ALSO removed (they had accepted the date and it was set for play). I mean we were 5-0 ranked 15. We finally got a hold on an admin yesterday but they obviously did not know about that clean out as they insisted the leader, myself, had dropped our team from the ladder (during the time I didn't check the site for two days).
The main reason I'm annoyed is because we had to go through a bunch of inactive teams to finally start playing and now we'd have to start over again. You might want to find out how we and the opposing team were confused as inactive.

Originally posted by: rustyCrVx
We were very active, DID have one week that we could not make it but was not counted as a forfeit loss, and had already scheduled a match against a team that was ALSO removed (they had accepted the date and it was set for play). I mean we were 5-0 ranked 15. We finally got a hold on an admin yesterday but they obviously did not know about that clean out as they insisted the leader, myself, had dropped our team from the ladder (during the time I didn't check the site for two days).
The main reason I'm annoyed is because we had to go through a bunch of inactive teams to finally start playing and now we'd have to start over again. You might want to find out how we and the opposing team were confused as inactive.

They won't listen to you. I had a long conversation about a match my team had accepted and scheduled which an admin forfeit against us claiming we never accepted the match. There are bugs on the site which they refuse to admit to until faced with overwhelming evidence, such as teams in the top 20 of the GunGame ladder being able to go on rest.

Originally posted by: Skulking
They won't listen to you. I had a long conversation about a match my team had accepted and scheduled which an admin forfeit against us claiming we never accepted the match. There are bugs on the site which they refuse to admit to until faced with overwhelming evidence, such as teams in the top 20 of the GunGame ladder being able to go on rest.

^ What he said

yeah, our match comms and match time got deleted and the admins said we didnt accept it and got a ffl. its the site or its an admin doing it, either way its annoying.

Ok, just wanted to let everyone know this is being looked in to, recently I just got promoted to Competition Director for CS:S. This gives me more access and hopefully able to find some answers for everyone on these issues. I will make sure that all of our staff is on the same page on processing 48 hour forfeits, but this is an issue that can never be totally cleared up without some team(s) being upset. Keep in mind that to remain active you must have played a match within the last two weeks, otherwise the system marks you as inactive.

Might want to think of sending some sort of warning to a team that they are about to be removed from the ladder for being inactive and if this is incorrect then to please contact an admin or something along those lines bc it's pretty annoying to get in the top20 where it's much more likely to face active teams then be removed and go through the mess of no shows/inactivity again, which I realize has supposedly been taken care of by the inactivity sweep but I won't believe that until I go through it again.

Anyways, gl with that Prince, hopefully you do actually take care of the situation.

New to TWL, but having read this thread, I believe rustyCrVx has a very good point in saying that teams ought to be warned before being removed from the ladder. As our team starts to become competitive, I'd hate to see something similar happen.

Cheers.

Originally posted by: Japanese Schoolgirl
New to TWL, but having read this thread, I believe rustyCrVx has a very good point in saying that teams ought to be warned before being removed from the ladder. As our team starts to become competitive, I'd hate to see something similar happen.

Cheers.

It is never an issue if you are active

Ignore what he said Japanese Schoolgirl, it clearly was an issue because we were constantly active and went from ranked 130 or w/e to 3 in just a few weeks but were unable to make ONE match, dropped to 15, scheduled another, communicated through matchcomm, and were removed (FAIL!). The only decent admin seems to be PrinceOfHonor since he at least says he'll look into it. The rest my team or I have talked to on IRC treat you like an idiot even when they're wrong or just don't seem to give a shit.

Originally posted by: rustyCrVx
Ignore what he said Japanese Schoolgirl, it clearly was an issue because we were constantly active and went from ranked 130 or w/e to 3 in just a few weeks but were unable to make ONE match, dropped to 15, scheduled another, communicated through matchcomm, and were removed (FAIL!). The only decent admin seems to be PrinceOfHonor since he at least says he'll look into it. The rest my team or I have talked to on IRC treat you like an idiot even when they're wrong or just don't seem to give a shit.

I know I do not treat anyone like an idiot.
It is possible that you were inactive for 2 weeks maybe you were sitting waiting to attack and you did not. There are many issues that go into this. (not saying that we have not made a mistake or 2 it does happen)

And with the match comm issue it could have been that you posted in 3v3 all weapons and it was a 3v3 pistol match. Something as simple as that.

Originally posted by: Skulking

They won't listen to you. I had a long conversation about a match my team had accepted and scheduled which an admin forfeit against us claiming we never accepted the match. There are bugs on the site which they refuse to admit to until faced with overwhelming evidence, such as teams in the top 20 of the GunGame ladder being able to go on rest.

And on this issue I asked a previous admin to look at the issue. I now have been promoted and was able to check it out for myself and found it was a setting which is now fixed.

Ok, let’s not get all hostile in this thread, a couple of points I wanted to make and allow a response. First what RB mentioned above is correct I was the admin in question, actually competition manager that dropped the ball on the challenge issue. Nobody changed anything, but when I setup the Gun Game when it first came out it must have been set so that the top 20 couldn't rest. Rubber Bullets have fixed this issue and everything is working great.

The second thing I would like to comment on is about staff and the community if you have issues with an admin please bring it up to the appropriate person that can deal with it. Our current chain of command for ladders is:

Competition Director: PrinceofHonor (All of the below, plus last word game side on any appeals.)

Competition Manager: Rubber Bullets (Can do everything below, as well as, has access to deal with steam id's and look up closed match comm's. Also is one of the steps in the appeal process game side.)

Lead Admin: Or1tE (Can do what the admin does, plus is the head admin for any admin complaints this would be your first stop.)

Admin (They can assist you with your question(s) on matches rules, 48 hour forfiets that are pending.)

Please remember that the staff are not paid they do this out of the kindness of their hearts, like everyone else we make mistakes. Any team or player issue shouldn't be posted in the forums, please contact an admin following the above chain.

Next when an admin looks at a ladder report if you haven't logged in or had a match in two weeks you are marked in red. If you plan on not challenging and you are below rung 20, please use the vacation option. This issue is one of those fine lines as we can't win for losing, either the ladders are filled with inactives or we have teams that complain due to them being removed after two weeks without matches on a ladder. Please note that each ladder is considered separate if you play a 5v5 regular match in two weeks, but have not played a 5v5 gun game in 2 weeks you will be removed from the 5v5 gun game.

Hopefully this clears up some issues, thanks for taking the time to read this huge post. If the thread becomes hostile it shall have to be locked, lets work out these issues and improve things for the whole community.
Post edited by PrinceofHonor at 6/16/2009 7:00:34 PM

If you look at his match history, you can see that there was no two week gap, and the admin actually had to forfeit a pending match to remove them from the ladder.

You gave me the same line when you forfeit my clans match, saying maybe we were looking at the wrong ladder. His clan was only on one ladder, so that makes it hard to post in match comms for a different ladder.

Come on guys, at least look into things like this a little bit before you post or you make a fool of yourself.

Originally posted by: Skulking
If you look at his match history, you can see that there was no two week gap, and the admin actually had to forfeit a pending match to remove them from the ladder.

You gave me the same line when you forfeit my clans match, saying maybe we were looking at the wrong ladder. His clan was only on one ladder, so that makes it hard to post in match comms for a different ladder.

Come on guys, at least look into things like this a little bit before you post or you make a fool of yourself.

Ok, my statements above were in general, as to specific team(s) please contact us and we can look it up and figure out what went wrong. Understand that we all have different levels of access so it might need to be worked on up the chain to find the person that can resolve the issue. To view match comm's on a match that has been reported takes Competition Manager and above to access that. The admin staff is usually good at bringing those issues that they don't have access to up to the appropriate level, but everyone needs to remain calm so that we can get a solution to the issues. May player(s) come to us flaming mad, which really becomes an issue; I have had player(s) who don't want to wait or be contacted with the right information demanding a response right on the spot. As the access isn't available the admin might feel that they have to give it a best guess answer instead of a well sorted out answer. These issues will be researched and addressed in and email to the team(s) as the forums aren't the place for individual issues.

please put my team back on the 5v5 ladder competition. we were have been one of the more active teams and did not ask to be removed.

nvm. just read my email.

Removal for excess forfeits are understandable, but our inactivity is due the the season starting and nobody challenging us. If this is the case, you should just remove the teams that are in league competitions. How many of them actively participate during the season? also, what was the immunity thing for? wasn't that to request for a period of inactivity?
Post edited by tC| TripleOptics at 6/22/2009 3:20:02 PM

Originally posted by: tC| TripleOptics
please put my team back on the 5v5 ladder competition. we were have been one of the more active teams and did not ask to be removed.

nvm. just read my email.

Removal for excess forfeits are understandable, but our inactivity is due the the season starting and nobody challenging us. If this is the case, you should just remove the teams that are in league competitions. How many of them actively participate during the season? also, what was the immunity thing for? wasn't that to request for a period of inactivity?

But you can challenge up correct? Your last match was 6/3/09 people complain that there are to many people to wade their way up the ladders but once there you need to keep challenging when you are not the defender.
Post edited by Rubber Bullets at 6/22/2009 3:24:37 PM