Stryfe on Competative Gaming

For all of you who do not frequent other forums, I figured I'd post this here.

Bdy did a good job of posting it at ProUnreal and UnrealNorth, but some of you guys might not go there.

http://one.revver.com/watch/386604
http://one.revver.com/watch/386626

I'm not sure where Bdy got it, but it's definitely a good watch :]

Thanks Bdy.

thanks for the post

semi interesting

I have contacts 8)

I wear glasses.

Meh, lot of whining about consoles... I agree on some points, but he seems to have a lot of misconceptions on the other appeals of consoles in competitive gaming.

Originally posted by: -AEnubis-
Meh, lot of whining about consoles... I agree on some points, but he seems to have a lot of misconceptions on the other appeals of consoles in competitive gaming.

like what? Everybody I've met that games online with a console is either a complete noob or a complete retard. Take your pic.

Originally posted by: alpha!
Take your pic.

Post edited by Rujman at 9/21/2007 6:12:19 AM

pcloadletter?

HAHA! I'm in love with this guy now. He speaks the truth!

Originally posted by: alpha!

Originally posted by: -AEnubis-
Meh, lot of whining about consoles... I agree on some points, but he seems to have a lot of misconceptions on the other appeals of consoles in competitive gaming.

like what? Everybody I've met that games online with a console is either a complete noob or a complete retard. Take your pic.

my roommate is a perfect example cuz he's both!

Ease of accessibility produces the kind of player you speak of, I agree that, that is a bad thing.

Consoles though, create a lot of consistencies that PC's do not. Same, or similar control interfaces, same graphics quality, same in game performance. Standards like that are good for competition. Most of there games, because of this stuff, and say, the lack of "ini tweaks" would make the "level ground" much more "out of the box" for consoles.

Other cool things would be how much less necessary it would be for you to play on your own box to play at your best. A memory card, or a quick config, and you're in there.

Especially with my control setup, I definitely couldn't go play at a lan, on a provided "generic" box.

Community wise, he has some good points, but he really doesn't understand what needs to happen to get lots of money involved.

I'm pretty bored waiting for my family to get ready to go eat,so I guess I'll post some nonesense... just consider this:

Talking specifically about FPS games: Varied control schemes are a much bigger issue on consoles than on PC. Difference is, 99% of "different" controller interfaces on PC's will still be a keyboard and mouse. And once you have a 2nd gen optical mouse and a keyboard that lets you push more than 3 buttons at once (a total of maybe $30 cost), you don't get any real advantage; buying nicer stuff becomes a matter of comfort/preference. Meanwhile you have people using 3rd-party converters to play with mice on games that aren't even designed for it on consoles. And anyone who has ever played fighting games knows how many different controllers there are for those...

Most competitive UT players don't use any "tweaks" that you can't legally set on LAN (i.e. through in-game menus only) for obvious reasons. But at least if a game's developers DO neglect to put something in the game menus (such as really low mouse sensitivity that certain mice need), you can always have a tourney admin oversee it being set. When console games don't offer all the settings they should, there's no way around it. Then again, for other games that DO allow custom configs, how is a USB drive any harder to pop in than a memory card? :>

The biggest advantage consoles have is that the INTERNAL hardware is more or less identical across a platform. So someone doesn't have an advantage for having 80 fps while another has 30 (because on consoles everyone gets 30! yay? ). Of course I've always been one of the people who say that no matches that matter should happen on anything other than identical competition-controlled machines on LAN. Online, software cheating is a bigger deal than hardware inconsistencies in my opinion, and no platform has solved that issue yet.

There's a lot of reasons console gaming has more economic advantages in North America, and few/none of them have anything to do with the quality of games or the community. Unfortunately, for many of these to change, some of the companies raking in dough currently would take a profit hit... so you know how that goes...

i heard theyre allowing mouse and keyboard for UT3 on ps3 is that correct? if thats the case, maybe consoles are going to be moving towards a better competitive direction?

lol.. stryfe claims there are diffrent "teirs" of player yet he doesn't mention that the play style adopted by those who are in the "higher" teirs are boring ass fuck to watch especially for someone who doesn't understand the game... Now with games that look hot with all the fancy little explosions and are simple to understand.. like grab a gun and fuck someones face.. those are simple enough to watch. I mean would anyone watch hockey if they didn't know what the point of the game is? No.


*edit* what's fucking sad is.. nobody plays the game because they love it. All everyone wants if money. Take that money and shove it up your fancy community.
Post edited by ARclite at 9/22/2007 3:53:27 AM

Originally posted by: ARclite


*edit* what's fucking sad is.. nobody plays the game because they love it. All everyone wants if money. Take that money and shove it up your fancy community.

That sounds like sofaking to a T.

dunno ive seen luxx and gohlink do some interesting stuff.

Originally posted by: ARclite
grab a gun and fuck someones face..

I loled. It paints such a vivid picture.

BTW. Someone needs to tell Stryfe that hat is gay as fuck.


Post edited by brane at 9/22/2007 7:01:51 AM

Originally posted by: brane

Originally posted by: ARclite
grab a gun and fuck someones face..

I loled. It paints such a vivid picture.

BTW. Someone needs to tell Stryfe that hat is gay as fuck.

i kno lol that hat was rofls

btw hi brane =o

"Comfort" on a foreign PC is possible to achieve yeah, but consoles do facilitate it much better. Bringing your own controller and memory card is much easier than mouse/keyboard/mousepad/flash memory, not to mention, that flash memory card may have to be examined... not likely, but the possibility is there.

I just think what really needs to happen is they need to design consoles and games for gaming communities. Consoles need internet access, voip, chat (irc), and games that are capable of crossing platform, enabling console gamers to play, watch, and communicate with the community. The combination of mass amounts of players, and spectators (consoles), and enthusiasts and server admins (PC's), are all as necessary to the sports success as are the pro's to watch, look up too, and learn from etc.

The problem is these pro's don't want there game dumbed down, but don't realize that money doesn't just come out of thin air. We need spectators. Even if consoles aren't attracting new talent and competition, they do create spectators who know the game, and are interested in it enough to watch the pro's play. Spectators leads to advertising leads to money to pay the pro's.

Originally posted by: -AEnubis-
Especially with my control setup, I definitely couldn't go play at a lan, on a provided "generic" box.

It's hardly a specific platform's fault if you've made the choice to use a control scheme that wouldn't be usable on LAN. More to the point, players who LAN are well aware of which settings are generally LAN-legal, and they use a setup that works for them online and on LAN. It's really not an inconvenience.

I agree with your other points, tho, and I'd even put a slightly different spin on it. Hardware inconsistency (when renting a box on LAN) may not be a huge problem for skilled players - but the primary benefits of the of ease-of-use of console competition aren't the players at all, but rather the organizers. It's several orders of magnitude easier to put together a LAN event with consoles versus PCs. I also think there's more immediate audience acceptance of spectating console esports than PC esports, based on the long tradition of passing controllers around with a few buddies in your living room.

And, of course, consoles generally present a lower barrier to entry for players (in terms of initial costs, peripherals, etc.), which may actually be much more significant than the standard playing environment.

If consoles really embrace mouse/keyboard, they'll have the chops to handle both FPS and RTS games and might eventually take over esports and the LAN world...for better or worse.

Everyone understands that spectators = money. We have this conversation on a weekly basis it seems like in IRC. But there's many ways to approach it. The problem (from the point of view in question) is that, as MTV has proven over and over, popularity doesn't = quality, even though it = money. And as gaming in the past few years has proven, neither popularity nor quality matter as long as the company behind a game is desperate enough to pay leagues to "choose" their games. A skateboarder once told me he couldn't stand how Bam Marjera rode his mediocre career into tons of money since high school white kids liked him, while guys like Rodney Mullen and Eric Kosten saw a fraction of the support. I think some people are just worried about gaming turning into a similar situation (yea it's a weird analogy but it's what came to mind).

I think this turn, where many games seem to only get competitive support if their publishers specifically subsidize it, is unsettling to people who had held out hope that maybe people would get into the complexity of their favorite games. In the current market, they wouldn't even get the chance because the most popular/mainstream (aka lowest common denominator) games are the only ones they'll even see.

And bringing your own "controller" for a console is only easier if you use a small handheld one, and not really much different at that. A kb/m/mousepad easily fits into most backpacks, and weighs maybe a couple pounds. Some of the arcade-style fighting sticks are much more bulky/heavy than your typical keyboard/mouse/mousepad, not to mention people who play on their console at home with (quasi-legal?) kb/m configs of their own. If you play with a default controller at home, you can show up and play on the default ones at the event and it'll feel the same. If you play with a generic type keyboard on the PC, and show up and use the ones on a LAN, the differences would be so miniscule (slightly looser/tighter keys, maybe the concavity is different) that it shouldn't take more than a few mins of warmup to feel comfortable again. People who are used to crazy stuff in either platform will have trouble adjusting to the more standard stuff.

Originally posted by: Suibhne
If consoles really embrace mouse/keyboard, they'll have the chops to handle both FPS and RTS games and might eventually take over esports and the LAN world...for better or worse.

If you already own a box that has a KB&M attached to it why would you buy another similarly priced box that also uses KB&M.

Aside from the obvious point that consoles are inferior machines why would you sacrifice more money and space at your house for a console. Computers are a necessity everyone has one. Just get a half decent one and you can have the best of both worlds.

my 2 cents. First of all, I have to say that although I agree with stryfe on some points, the guy sounds like an idiot...certainly not the best spokes-person for the ut community. Secondly, What the hell does he keep looking at in the interview? Did it bother anyone else that his eyes were darting around throughout the entire interview? Thirdly, pro-gaming is cool. But I think where alot of people go wrong, is taking a game too far and neglecting the fact that it was a device meant for entertainment. When he was asked if he was going to play the game and he said "only if I get paid" I just laughed. I mean c'mon. you know that bastard is going to play the game. At the very least he'll be aliasing it up like crazy. I dunno, I mean I have to say. Console gaming sucks. I've played halo like...twice. Each time I played it, it just made me laugh. I cant believe there are people out there who think that being "good" at halo makes them "leet".

As for people who dont think they could ever play at lans on a generic computer because of your ini settings, I still dont understand that. Maybe I'm a complete noob, but I've been playing this game for about 5 years and have NEVER even looked at or touched my ini files. What in god's name could you possibly do to them that would make it so you couldnt play the game on stock settings? Better yet, why? lol, maybe there's something about ini settings I just dont get.

whoa whoa system, u got a few points wrong there...


his eyes were darting around maybe becuz the sun could be in his eyes, or he didn't want to stare in the camera 24/7, or he got distracted by a dozen ppl walking around him while hes sitting there talking about an online game.


he said he will still play the game, but he will only play competitively (going to lans) if he gets paid. i totally agree with him if i did what he did. which is, he paid everything himself, hotel, plane ticket, etc. hes saying why should i lose a crapload of money to go to a lan that won't matter? or give anything back?


as for your ini, i believe u can just basically email yourself the ini, and replace it while at the lan. if you're not allowed, then i'm sure u can remember changes. but in 99, if i'm not mistaken, you're not allowed to do ANY tweaks. i think i like this idea.

Almost all UT2k4 LAN competitions (that used standard competition PC's; BYOC ones don't apply obviously) have not allowed you to so much as open the console unless an admin is there to watch. And the only real reasons to do this are to change mouse sensitivity below what the menu allows, or to bind suicide (which only matters in CTF).