TDM 2v2 roster limit Help

Hello guys,
On my team lots of people are back to school, biggest holidays are coming, ppl with new jobs, etc etc etc, so I was wondering if theres enough support from the other teams and TWL admins to open roster to 8 players instead of 5, please... will make things easier for real.
Anyone? ,

Thank You very much

vet
ThE VET

5 is the limit if people are inactive do the hard thing as a founder and make room for the more active people. Other teams do this all the time. Managing a team is as much a part of being on ladders as playing matches.

Vet:
I complained about this ages ago. Even though there are teams with more than 5 on there now... give up.
Post edited by sk`` at 9/8/2007 6:33:22 PM

rgr that SK
ty
ThE VET

Rediculous, if you can't feild 2 outta 5, maybe you need to work on management skills instead of trying to change a rule.

Nice roster btw.

---

KillEmAll
TeamWarfare Anti-Cheat Manager for UT Series
Email: killemall@teamwarfare.com
IRC: #teamwarfare, #twl_UT

why is there a limit on the roster, anyway? the only reason i can think of is it would force people to make more teams, but that's never going to happen in this dead community.

KEA:
TWL constantly trumps they are for the "casual" and "amature" players. However doesn't that grind against rules like this? A "casual" team shouldn't be so concerned with management that they must carefully moderate how many players are in a given team.

Correct?

However, rules like this only assert that TWL forwards this stance when it is convenient to counter points regarding other rules. From my POV, even the pay leagues don't care how many people you put on a roster - why does "casual" TWL make rules that oppose this?

it creates more teams. 5 man roster limits makes it more of a "TEAM" and less of just stacking players. When UT2k4 was more popular many clans had 2 teams. It also supports activity.

If you have a player that doesn't show up consistently, boot him/her and get a active member.
Post edited by {DS}Pure_Evil at 9/8/2007 10:22:39 PM

Originally posted by: {DS}Pure_Evil
it creates more teams. 5 man roster limits makes it more of a "TEAM" and less of just stacking players. When UT2k4 was more popular many clans had 2 teams. It also supports activity.

If you have a player that doesn't show up consistently, boot him/her and get a active member.

When 2k4 was more active is the keyword there.

PE:
You're NEVER going to stop stacking. It's as basic as gravity. Moreover, as a "casual" league what do you care if people stack?

When I brought the issue up originally pure was facing teams who had their rostered before the change and thus could easily throw 8 people at us. As a casual league making sure 2 of the 5 make match time isn't automatic. Things happen, people get jobs, school, etc.

There's no logical reason to limit it on a "casual" ladder. Unless of course you'd like to reverse that stance and then you have reason to issue a limit.

Originally posted by: sk``
Vet:
I complained about this ages ago. Even though there are teams with more than 5 on there now... give up.

sk:
This is your best post. We all know you have taken to complain about everything TWL. The burning question is can you not complain about everything TWL?

Mong:
As long as my team or teams I respect comp here I will drive it to be better. I expect the same of any league/ladder.

It is still a shame that you fail to grasp the must fundamental principles of admin work - customer service: unpaid and unappreciated done out of the love for competition. I mean no insult in this, but you and many of the TWL admins treat this as a silent decision making role when it should be anything but. Many of you don't seem to even hold much a passion for competition and thus cry when faced with whiney competitors.

so that's a no, you could have just said "no mong I can't not complain about everything TWL."

"silent decision make role" made me laugh, thanks

Originally posted by: sk``
Vet:
I complained about this ages ago. Even though there are teams with more than 5 on there now... give up.

Actually, for ages there was NO limit. It was not until TAM 2v2 got a vote, then a limit that TDM got a limit, with out a vote of any kind.

Although i do agree about having a roster limit, even though it meant I had to drop from the roster to make room for better players. However it should be removed and properly voted on. I was not very happy when I had to email PE to figure out what was going on.
Post edited by {pdX}Lostsoul at 9/9/2007 3:05:29 PM

Originally posted by: {pdX}Lostsoul

Originally posted by: sk``
Vet:
I complained about this ages ago. Even though there are teams with more than 5 on there now... give up.

Actually, for ages there was NO limit. It was not until TAM 2v2 got a vote, then a limit that TDM got a limit, with out a vote of any kind.

Although i do agree about having a roster limit, even though it meant I had to drop from the roster to make room for better players. However it should be removed and properly voted on. I was not very happy when I had to email PE to figure out what was going on.

it was all voted on here a year ago. it was made clear the vote would effect all 2v2 ladders.

Mong:
LOL dude... you're a tad crazy. Anyway, why don't you put something simple to mind? Of course I'm the great evil of TWL's bane, etc... but, if I'm your sole squeaky wheel where's the counter point? Where are the non-admins rushing to defend TWL against me? Why is it that the overwhelming public outcry here is negative?

Of course, all leagues suffer the same way, but in all my years of competitive play at many different leagues I've never seen anything on the scale of TWL's public mind share.

On another note, since we voted on TDM 2v2 would you mind quoting it? I recall the last time this topic was up many active TDM teams wanted more than 5. Now it doesn't matter... the ladder is long since dead.

Originally posted by: mongeau
it was all voted on here a year ago. it was made clear the vote would effect all 2v2 ladders.

TAM was, not TDM. I remember when it happened and I remember talking to PE about it.

sk you give yourself way too much credit, "the bane of twl" for enforcing a rule that existed long b4 you came to be involved in that little league.

ls it was discussed on these forums for over a month. It was also mentioned that it would affect all 2v2 ladders.

Originally posted by: sk``
Vet:
I complained about this ages ago. Even though there are teams with more than 5 on there now... give up.

no such teams exist

Originally posted by: mongeau
ls it was discussed on these forums for over a month. It was also mentioned that it would affect all 2v2 ladders.

Proof?

Originally posted by: {pdX}Lostsoul

Originally posted by: mongeau
ls it was discussed on these forums for over a month. It was also mentioned that it would affect all 2v2 ladders.

Proof?

hey Bro, I personally sent out a e-mail to the founders, please, don't challenge me.

I for one have NEVER been somebody who likes limits on team sizes . . for 3v3 and higher. But when the 2v2 thread was out, I do recall explaining that I feel there should be some limit. The reason is when you play 3v3 and higher, you play a team. You want to know about the team, the maps, etc. When you play 2v2, you want to know about the PLAYERS. Having no limits or a roster of 8 is way too big.

PG's limit for a 2v2 I believe was . . 2. IGL's was 3 or 4. TWL with their ideas on 5 has been the most lenient so please don't complain about 5 compared to the history of 2v2s before TWL.

---

|NERV|NapalmDawn
TeamWarfare Competition Manager
Email: NapalmDawn@teamwarfare.com
IRC: #teamwarfare, #twl_UT

Originally posted by: {DS}Pure_Evil
it creates more teams. 5 man roster limits makes it more of a "TEAM" and less of just stacking players. When UT2k4 was more popular many clans had 2 teams. It also supports activity.

If you have a player that doesn't show up consistently, boot him/her and get a active member.

Originally posted by: napalmDawn

When you play 2v2, you want to know about the PLAYERS. Having no limits or a roster of 8 is way too big.

No. I think you're flat wrong. When I played 2v2 I didn't care about who I was playing, I just wanted to play. I constantly had to turnover the 2v2 roster because people would go inactive and then come back and then go inactive again. There was always somebody on at matchtime that could have been my partner, but it was always a case of whether or not they were on the 2v2 roster that week or not. I ended up having to drop the team from the ladder because I couldn't get the kind of activity from 5 players you guys want to demand. If I could have put the whole team on that roster I could have grabbed any random guy and we would have stayed on the ladder a lot longer. So you tell me how your rule created more teams there.

Also, I'm not sure where you think these active players come from that you can just replace your inactives with...
Post edited by slyde at 9/10/2007 1:14:24 PM

Originally posted by: {DS}Pure_Evil

Originally posted by: {pdX}Lostsoul

Originally posted by: mongeau
ls it was discussed on these forums for over a month. It was also mentioned that it would affect all 2v2 ladders.

Proof?

hey Bro, I personally sent out a e-mail to the founders, please, don't challenge me.

The TDM change/proposal was never announced publicly, only TAM. Hence why I had to email you to figure out what was going on when pdX reorganized. Mind you, i like the rule and agree it should be in place, there was just not any public thing saying that TDM would be changed, nor did you saying anything of the sort to me after I emailed you, you did raise the limit though.

Originally posted by: slyde
I'm not sure where you think these active players come from that you can just replace your inactives with...

Where there is a will, there is a way. I have always considered the main purpose of a limit so that in a 2v2 you knew who you where going to play. It is a lot funner to look at the roster of a challenger and have an idea of who you are playing so you can prepare. Looking at a roster with 25 players is rather useless.

people want to keep increasing the number of players on a roster... I'd say that's where the active players come from. It's not TWL's fault you couldn't get consistency from your crew

Originally posted by: {pdX}Lostsoul

Originally posted by: {DS}Pure_Evil

Originally posted by: {pdX}Lostsoul

Originally posted by: mongeau
ls it was discussed on these forums for over a month. It was also mentioned that it would affect all 2v2 ladders.

Proof?

hey Bro, I personally sent out a e-mail to the founders, please, don't challenge me.

The TDM change/proposal was never announced publicly, only TAM. Hence why I had to email you to figure out what was going on when pdX reorganized. Mind you, i like the rule and agree it should be in place, there was just not any public thing saying that TDM would be changed, nor did you saying anything of the sort to me after I emailed you, you did raise the limit though.

Actually TDM wasn't changed their roster limit remains at 6 not the 5 for the other 2v2 ladders. What was done is teams with more than 6 were asked to prune their rosters those that didn't had it done for them.


Now I'm trying to get all 2v2 ladders the same like it should be. Hope the community cares enough to vote. Increasing the limit is the easy way

Originally posted by: mongeau
people want to keep increasing the number of players on a roster... I'd say that's where the active players come from. It's not TWL's fault you couldn't get consistency from your crew

The point is, the game's at a different stage now. A lot of teams have longtime players with a year or two invested in the clan, who might only be able to play every third or fourth match, and a casual team would like to continue welcoming its longtime members. It's a bummer to kick them to the kerb just because of the roster limit. I get the point of using a roster limit to increase competition, but A) it's not accomplishing that any longer, and B) it's a basically non-competitive ladder anyway.

Get rid of the roster limits for the end of UT2k4 imo. Think about reinstating some for league (not ladder) play in UT3 gametypes with very small teams.

Originally posted by: mongeau
Actually TDM wasn't changed their roster limit remains at 6 not the 5 for the other 2v2 ladders. What was done is teams with more than 6 were asked to prune their rosters those that didn't had it done for them.

Wrong, it was 5. It got changed to 6 shortly after though. I had been able to prune down the pdX roster to 6 people. I then told PE that I need a sixth spot so that I could fit Apps back on the team. Other people must have said something because he bumped it up to six the next day.

You don't really seem to know much about this Mong to be commenting.

Originally posted by: mongeau
people want to keep increasing the number of players on a roster... I'd say that's where the active players come from. It's not TWL's fault you couldn't get consistency from your crew

Jesus Christ, this really isn't that hard to understand. The reason for increasing the roster limit isn't to add active players, its to allow you to keep semi-active to moderately-inactive players on the roster incase they happen to be online and you need a player.

At no point did I blame twl for the consistency of my crew. What I do blame twl for is bad rules that forced me to leave the ladder. If you read my story and that of the OP, you'll see a common theme which is "THE CURRENT RULESET IS MAKING IT DIFFICULT FOR ME TO KEEP MY TEAM ON THIS LADDER! ADJUST THEM SO WE CAN KEEP PLAYING HERE"

The playerbase isn't growing, if it were a roster limit would definitely create more teams, I'm not gonna argue with you about that. I'd bet that the business people involved with TWL would be very disappointed if they knew you guys were bashing teams instead of making a simple rule change to help them out. I promise you that the head staff wants there to be as many teams as possible on every ladder for advertising revenue.

Originally posted by: {pdX}Lostsoul

Originally posted by: mongeau
Actually TDM wasn't changed their roster limit remains at 6 not the 5 for the other 2v2 ladders. What was done is teams with more than 6 were asked to prune their rosters those that didn't had it done for them.

Wrong, it was 5. It got changed to 6 shortly after though. I had been able to prune down the pdX roster to 6 people. I then told PE that I need a sixth spot so that I could fit Apps back on the team. Other people must have said something because he bumped it up to six the next day.

You don't really seem to know much about this Mong to be commenting.

proof?

Originally posted by: {DS}Pure_Evil
don't challenge me.

LOL, rich.

Originally posted by: mongeau

Originally posted by: {pdX}Lostsoul

Originally posted by: mongeau
Actually TDM wasn't changed their roster limit remains at 6 not the 5 for the other 2v2 ladders. What was done is teams with more than 6 were asked to prune their rosters those that didn't had it done for them.

Wrong, it was 5. It got changed to 6 shortly after though. I had been able to prune down the pdX roster to 6 people. I then told PE that I need a sixth spot so that I could fit Apps back on the team. Other people must have said something because he bumped it up to six the next day.

You don't really seem to know much about this Mong to be commenting.

proof?

You would ignore any proof, but ask PE for the emails, I am sure he kept them. I deleted mine when I dropped from TWL.
Post edited by {pdX}Lostsoul at 9/10/2007 5:36:00 PM

Originally posted by: slyde




I ended up having to drop the team from the ladder because I couldn't get the kind of activity from 5 players you guys want to demand. If I could have put the whole team on that roster I could have grabbed any random guy and we would have stayed on the ladder a lot longer. So you tell me how your rule created more teams there.

sounds like your blaming TWL to me man, if you're not that's fine. Hell if you are that's fine too that's what people do.

Also that's part of why there's a limit "grabbing any random guy"
Post edited by mongeau at 9/10/2007 5:40:56 PM

Set the limit to 3.

It's 2v2 for a reason, I agree to a backup for real life stuff.

Just my opinion,
Nothing more, Nothing less.

---

KillEmAll
TeamWarfare Anti-Cheat Manager for UT Series
Email: killemall@teamwarfare.com
IRC: #teamwarfare, #twl_UT

KEA:
So then 4v4 should be 5, 5v5 6, and 6v6 7? Why hasn't anyone addressed my root point? If TWL is "casual" as they say when people demand more progressive competitive changes... why should something like this matter? If you look at the trends all it has done is harm the ladder.

Originally posted by: slyde
Jesus Christ, this really isn't that hard to understand. The reason for increasing the roster limit isn't to add active players, its to allow you to keep semi-active to moderately-inactive players on the roster incase they happen to be online and you need a player.

Bingo.

Yes our players all have real lifes , and they all want to play, when they can..

I didnt know this was such a tight administration, thats why seems many times things here kinda stink. I am posting a request and i even say please, and some of the Admins answers are just bs talking against the "manager" with stupid automatic responses... please I though this was an amateur league. you can kiss my ass too.

personaly I think you guys r way to out of your Head, and Sofa quit waisting your time with these fools.

Who the fuck is the ADMIN for the $ of this place? this noobs are going to sink your place dude, get people who knows a bit of PR for this communities if you want to get better than this.

I am pulling PUB outt of this shithole. hope you dont delete this post either and show it to your boss noob.

Makes me want to open our own ladder to be honest.

Later

VET


ThE VET